Canon Discussion: The Illustrious Client
Nov. 9th, 2014 08:32 am![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
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sherlock60This week, we’re having a look at The Illustrious Client. As always, I’ve typed up a few thoughts to get the discussion started.
"It can't hurt now," was Mr. Sherlock Holmes's comment when, for the tenth time in as many years, I asked his leave to reveal the following narrative. Any thoughts on why it won’t matter now if Watson publishes the case? Surely not everyone involved can have died.
I was living in my own rooms in Queen Anne Street at the time… Well, this is all very intriguing. Why isn’t Watson at Baker Street any more? Living in “rooms”, to me, doesn’t suggest Watson has remarried. (Though in BLAN, Holmes does say Watson has “deserted” him for “a wife”. BLAN is set in January 1903—that isn’t long after this story, which is set in September 1902.) It also doesn’t suggest he has his own practice again. (Watson does tell Gruner he is a doctor in practice but that may be simply for his cover story. Holmes says: “You may as well be a medical man, since that is a part which you can play without duplicity.”) The friendship between Holmes and Watson is still solid. It’s just odd that they are abruptly living apart. And living apart so close together. (The streets appear to be less than a mile from each other.)
“The villain attached himself to the lady, and with such effect that he has completely and absolutely won her heart.” I wonder what is going through Gruner’s mind with reference to marrying Miss de Merville. He certainly doesn’t love her—he talks of controlling her with hypnotism. Is it simply lust and marriage is the only way he can have her because of her social position? Then when he’s bored, he’ll dispose of her and move on to the next woman.
…for I had some pressing professional business of my own… What is this business? Again, the wording doesn’t suggest to me a medical matter.
"Must you interfere? Does it really matter if he marries the girl?" This seems an oddly dispassionate thing for the kind Watson to say. Holmes in comparison is positively anxious about Miss de Merville: "I was sorry for her, Watson. I thought of her for the moment as I would have thought of a daughter of my own.”
“But what I am Adelbert Gruner made me.” Put bluntly, I assume Miss Winter lost her virginity and reputation to Gruner and after she left him she became a prostitute. But I don’t think we’re getting the full story somehow. Later, there’s evidence that comes out at Kitty Winter’s trial that reduces her sentence to the lowest possible.
There was a curious secretive streak in the man which led to many dramatic effects, but left even his closest friend guessing as to what his exact plans might be. Wouldn’t it have been more sensible for Holmes to tell Watson what was going on? The poor man doesn’t realise that he’s supposed to be keeping Gruner busy while Holmes burgles the place. It’s a dangerous situation for both of them.
“I knew I had only a few minutes in which to act, for my time was limited by your knowledge of Chinese pottery.” Yes—so why not come up with a better diversion!
Such extenuating circumstances came out in the trial that the sentence, as will be remembered was the lowest that was possible for such an offence. How do you feel about Kitty Winter’s attack on Gruner? It is stomach churning, reading about the man’s injuries—and I don’t think she was justified in taking her revenge in this way. But it is difficult to be concerned about Gruner.
Next Sunday, 16th November, we’ll be having a look at The Mazarin Stone. Hope you can join us then.
"It can't hurt now," was Mr. Sherlock Holmes's comment when, for the tenth time in as many years, I asked his leave to reveal the following narrative. Any thoughts on why it won’t matter now if Watson publishes the case? Surely not everyone involved can have died.
I was living in my own rooms in Queen Anne Street at the time… Well, this is all very intriguing. Why isn’t Watson at Baker Street any more? Living in “rooms”, to me, doesn’t suggest Watson has remarried. (Though in BLAN, Holmes does say Watson has “deserted” him for “a wife”. BLAN is set in January 1903—that isn’t long after this story, which is set in September 1902.) It also doesn’t suggest he has his own practice again. (Watson does tell Gruner he is a doctor in practice but that may be simply for his cover story. Holmes says: “You may as well be a medical man, since that is a part which you can play without duplicity.”) The friendship between Holmes and Watson is still solid. It’s just odd that they are abruptly living apart. And living apart so close together. (The streets appear to be less than a mile from each other.)
“The villain attached himself to the lady, and with such effect that he has completely and absolutely won her heart.” I wonder what is going through Gruner’s mind with reference to marrying Miss de Merville. He certainly doesn’t love her—he talks of controlling her with hypnotism. Is it simply lust and marriage is the only way he can have her because of her social position? Then when he’s bored, he’ll dispose of her and move on to the next woman.
…for I had some pressing professional business of my own… What is this business? Again, the wording doesn’t suggest to me a medical matter.
"Must you interfere? Does it really matter if he marries the girl?" This seems an oddly dispassionate thing for the kind Watson to say. Holmes in comparison is positively anxious about Miss de Merville: "I was sorry for her, Watson. I thought of her for the moment as I would have thought of a daughter of my own.”
“But what I am Adelbert Gruner made me.” Put bluntly, I assume Miss Winter lost her virginity and reputation to Gruner and after she left him she became a prostitute. But I don’t think we’re getting the full story somehow. Later, there’s evidence that comes out at Kitty Winter’s trial that reduces her sentence to the lowest possible.
There was a curious secretive streak in the man which led to many dramatic effects, but left even his closest friend guessing as to what his exact plans might be. Wouldn’t it have been more sensible for Holmes to tell Watson what was going on? The poor man doesn’t realise that he’s supposed to be keeping Gruner busy while Holmes burgles the place. It’s a dangerous situation for both of them.
“I knew I had only a few minutes in which to act, for my time was limited by your knowledge of Chinese pottery.” Yes—so why not come up with a better diversion!
Such extenuating circumstances came out in the trial that the sentence, as will be remembered was the lowest that was possible for such an offence. How do you feel about Kitty Winter’s attack on Gruner? It is stomach churning, reading about the man’s injuries—and I don’t think she was justified in taking her revenge in this way. But it is difficult to be concerned about Gruner.
Next Sunday, 16th November, we’ll be having a look at The Mazarin Stone. Hope you can join us then.
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no subject
Date: 2014-11-09 01:05 pm (UTC)This story starts on 3rd of September 1902. Now, Holmes returned in April 1894. That is nearly ten years. So how come he is able to state this in cold blood: "If your man is more dangerous than the late Professor Moriarty, or than the living Colonel Sebastian Moran, then he is indeed worth meeting." Living?! How could Moran be still alive? He was arrested for the murder of Ronald Adair. Excuse me, but I thought that the punishment for murder in England back then was gallows. Did he escape? That hardly seems possible, he was all over revenging the Professor's death, so Holmes, and Watson particularly, wouldn't be to relaxed about it.
So ... any ideas? I have one.
no subject
Date: 2014-11-09 04:50 pm (UTC)A suggestion, only. Moran does have bravery and loyalty. Perhaps his military record was so good, and army acquaintances could swear to a heroic action or two, that his sentance was lower than Adair's family considered just.
no subject
Date: 2014-11-09 10:02 pm (UTC)... Gosh NO! Stay away, you wild plotbunny! Stay away!
I really didn't plan to expand this idea, but now ... it intrigues me more and more.
no subject
Date: 2014-11-09 10:38 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-11-09 08:36 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-11-09 10:13 pm (UTC)Hmmm, I think that Mycroft would have pulled all possible strings to get Colonel out of the way for definite, hence protecting his younger brother.
Do you think that the execution could have been delayed for so long for any reason, like another grave accusations?
no subject
Date: 2014-11-10 04:13 pm (UTC)I know pretty much nothing about the law in Victorian times (or the law now, to be honest ^^) but that's a thought - I suppose it's possible Moran's execution might be delayed if he was going to be tried for other crimes. But delayed for 8 years..? I don't know.