Canon Discussion: The Three Students
Oct. 4th, 2015 08:13 am![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
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sherlock60This week we’re having a look at The Three Students. I’ve typed up a few thoughts and questions to get the discussion going—please leave your own ideas in the comments!
It was in the year '95 that a combination of events, into which I need not enter… Any thoughts? Why is Watson being so vague? Were the events mundane, embarrassing, something they had to be discreet about? My friend's temper had not improved since he had been deprived of the congenial surroundings of Baker Street. Holmes plainly would rather go back home, so there must be a significant reason why he can’t.
...our great University towns… Which one do you think? Place your bets. I always incline towards Cambridge—for no very compelling reason though, I must admit.
With due discretion the incident itself may, however, be described… Is Watson doing this for all his stories—even when he doesn’t explicitly say so? Is he always discreet about the true details?
Sherlock Holmes was pursuing some laborious researches in early English charters — researches which led to results so striking that they may be the subject of one of my future narratives. This seems so unlikely… The results being striking I mean. Any thoughts on what happened that was exciting enough for Watson to consider making a story out of it? And incidentally, what was Watson doing all the time Holmes was carrying out his ”laborious researches”?
...we received a visit from an acquaintance, Mr. Hilton Soames… I personally think the implication is that they both knew Soames before this particular stay. We have: I had always known him to be restless in his manner… and I was at my wits' ends, when suddenly the happy thought occurred to me that you were in the town… The latter is perhaps less definite but it does imply to me a prior acquaintance—Soames and Holmes haven’t met for the first time on this stay. So, how and why did Holmes and Watson become acquainted with Soames?
...the Fortescue Scholarship. Any thoughts on the generous (and presumably late) Fortescue?
“The exercise consists of half a chapter of Thucydides.” Did Gilchrist actually need to try to copy out the examination paper? The History of the Peloponnesian War is a huge work but wouldn’t there be references on the examination paper to say exactly where the passage was taken from? Presumably Gilchrist would be able to find it in the university library and copy it there.
“At four-thirty my task was not yet completed. I had, however, promised to take tea in a friend's rooms…” This does seem like a bit of an odd thing to do. Surely reading through the proofs was urgent. And what if the proofs needed reprinting? Soames returns to his rooms at approximately half past 5—would the printers have reprinted them that evening if there had been a problem? Though![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
thesmallhobbit did make the excellent point in the previous 3STU discussion post that as the printers would be using reusable type, they would want to do the reprinting as close to the original printing as possible.
"You are aware, Mr. Holmes, that our college doors are double…” Presumably Holmes has visited the college, but was he perhaps actually a student at “St. Luke’s” at some point?
"Did anyone know that these proofs would be there?" "No one save the printer." "Did this man Bannister know?" "No, certainly not. No one knew." Surely, anyone could have worked out that Soames would have the proofs in his rooms that day. It’s the day before the examinations start and he’s one of the examiners.
“Not one of your cases, Watson — mental, not physical. All right; come if you want to.” An unusual thing to say—I don’t think Holmes makes this distinction anywhere else. And a bit mean, to be honest. He really must be missing Baker Street.
“There are your three men. It must be one of them. You take your choice. Which is yours?" I think here we have a very good example of why it’s important for Holmes to be dispassionate and detached. Soames tries to be fair but he clearly admires Gilchrist, is neutral about Daulat Ras and disapproves of Miles McLaren, and that sways his opinion. Watson goes with first impressions (and perhaps a bit of racism), and his misinterpretations of those impressions. But Holmes stands back and observes the situation, and sees the three students as they actually are.
“As to his escaping by that window, it was incredible.” Why couldn’t Gilchrist have escaped by the bedroom window? It’s never quite made clear. The window in the sitting room is too small for a man to pass through and is in full view of other rooms. But the bedroom window is "Lattice-paned, lead framework, three separate windows, one swinging on hinge and large enough to admit a man." "Exactly. And it looks out on an angle of the courtyard so as to be partly invisible.” And it’s on the ground floor. Gilchrist didn’t get out that way—but why couldn’t he have?
Do you think either Daulat Ras or McLaren won the scholarship? It’s never made explicit in the story but I would assume there were more students entered for the exam than the three we meet here. "I understand you to say that there are three students who use this stair and are in the habit of passing your door?" Daulat Ras, McLaren and Gilchrist are the only ones mentioned because they’re the only likely suspects for copying the papers.
Next Sunday, 11th October, we’ll be having a look at The Golden Pince-Nez. Hope you can join us then.
It was in the year '95 that a combination of events, into which I need not enter… Any thoughts? Why is Watson being so vague? Were the events mundane, embarrassing, something they had to be discreet about? My friend's temper had not improved since he had been deprived of the congenial surroundings of Baker Street. Holmes plainly would rather go back home, so there must be a significant reason why he can’t.
...our great University towns… Which one do you think? Place your bets. I always incline towards Cambridge—for no very compelling reason though, I must admit.
With due discretion the incident itself may, however, be described… Is Watson doing this for all his stories—even when he doesn’t explicitly say so? Is he always discreet about the true details?
Sherlock Holmes was pursuing some laborious researches in early English charters — researches which led to results so striking that they may be the subject of one of my future narratives. This seems so unlikely… The results being striking I mean. Any thoughts on what happened that was exciting enough for Watson to consider making a story out of it? And incidentally, what was Watson doing all the time Holmes was carrying out his ”laborious researches”?
...we received a visit from an acquaintance, Mr. Hilton Soames… I personally think the implication is that they both knew Soames before this particular stay. We have: I had always known him to be restless in his manner… and I was at my wits' ends, when suddenly the happy thought occurred to me that you were in the town… The latter is perhaps less definite but it does imply to me a prior acquaintance—Soames and Holmes haven’t met for the first time on this stay. So, how and why did Holmes and Watson become acquainted with Soames?
...the Fortescue Scholarship. Any thoughts on the generous (and presumably late) Fortescue?
“The exercise consists of half a chapter of Thucydides.” Did Gilchrist actually need to try to copy out the examination paper? The History of the Peloponnesian War is a huge work but wouldn’t there be references on the examination paper to say exactly where the passage was taken from? Presumably Gilchrist would be able to find it in the university library and copy it there.
“At four-thirty my task was not yet completed. I had, however, promised to take tea in a friend's rooms…” This does seem like a bit of an odd thing to do. Surely reading through the proofs was urgent. And what if the proofs needed reprinting? Soames returns to his rooms at approximately half past 5—would the printers have reprinted them that evening if there had been a problem? Though
thesmallhobbit did make the excellent point in the previous 3STU discussion post that as the printers would be using reusable type, they would want to do the reprinting as close to the original printing as possible."You are aware, Mr. Holmes, that our college doors are double…” Presumably Holmes has visited the college, but was he perhaps actually a student at “St. Luke’s” at some point?
"Did anyone know that these proofs would be there?" "No one save the printer." "Did this man Bannister know?" "No, certainly not. No one knew." Surely, anyone could have worked out that Soames would have the proofs in his rooms that day. It’s the day before the examinations start and he’s one of the examiners.
“Not one of your cases, Watson — mental, not physical. All right; come if you want to.” An unusual thing to say—I don’t think Holmes makes this distinction anywhere else. And a bit mean, to be honest. He really must be missing Baker Street.
“There are your three men. It must be one of them. You take your choice. Which is yours?" I think here we have a very good example of why it’s important for Holmes to be dispassionate and detached. Soames tries to be fair but he clearly admires Gilchrist, is neutral about Daulat Ras and disapproves of Miles McLaren, and that sways his opinion. Watson goes with first impressions (and perhaps a bit of racism), and his misinterpretations of those impressions. But Holmes stands back and observes the situation, and sees the three students as they actually are.
“As to his escaping by that window, it was incredible.” Why couldn’t Gilchrist have escaped by the bedroom window? It’s never quite made clear. The window in the sitting room is too small for a man to pass through and is in full view of other rooms. But the bedroom window is "Lattice-paned, lead framework, three separate windows, one swinging on hinge and large enough to admit a man." "Exactly. And it looks out on an angle of the courtyard so as to be partly invisible.” And it’s on the ground floor. Gilchrist didn’t get out that way—but why couldn’t he have?
Do you think either Daulat Ras or McLaren won the scholarship? It’s never made explicit in the story but I would assume there were more students entered for the exam than the three we meet here. "I understand you to say that there are three students who use this stair and are in the habit of passing your door?" Daulat Ras, McLaren and Gilchrist are the only ones mentioned because they’re the only likely suspects for copying the papers.
Next Sunday, 11th October, we’ll be having a look at The Golden Pince-Nez. Hope you can join us then.
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no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 11:20 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 11:54 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 06:12 pm (UTC)I suspect though the dull truth is that the "events" were mundane and that's the only reason Watson didn't mention them.
no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 08:10 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 08:55 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 11:58 am (UTC)What's interesting to me is that Gilchrist has already been offered a commission in the Rhodesian police. I'm assuming trying for the scholarship was a last attempt to stay at the university, but he must have been aware he was risking the commission by his actions.
no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 04:33 pm (UTC)I don't think personally that trying for the scholarship was his last attempt to stay - that if he didn't get that money he'd have to go. It's just that suddenly temptation was put in his way, and because of his constant anxiety the money seemed more important than keeping to his own set of morals. I don't think he was thinking clearly about his future at all really - commission or studying. He was just caught up in the moment and the hope of receiving the scholarship money. He couldn't think beyond that.
no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 06:19 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 06:44 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2015-10-04 08:11 pm (UTC)